Oligarchy or Democracy
Now that we are in the Socratic period of Greek Philosophy, it’s important to note the shift from beliefs about the origin of the universe to a focus on human concerns. There’s now a need to take the pre-Socratic lens that questioned religious explanations for everything and to begin the long debate about the role of religion, to explore what is allowed to be questioned, and to define what is a wise citizen and a wise government. To bring Classical Athens to life, it’s important to take a look at what the contemporaneous beliefs were and how the power structure was reinforced and rewarded. This helps to raise the stakes so people realize that the freedom to speak, to question authority, and to demand reform, is not a dry exercise, but the most dangerous place to be in for a deep thinker. Societies that punish freedom of speech, you can count on them doing this because they are trying to protect their power structure that preserves their access to consume rewards, and consumption is addictive. Reforms inevitably lead to withdrawal symptoms and the powerful would prefer to avoid that by silencing and punishing those who dare to question them.
With an understanding of the persecution of Socrates, it’s easy to see why the ancient Greeks were struggling to know what a just society was, and as Plato later labeled as the important danger arising from appetite, any human structures deal constantly with outsized appetites and try to measure what is considered a fair satisfaction. Exploitation always follows outsized appetites when they take beyond their contribution and the result eventually is a form of slavery where people are working for little reward and are not able to own property following restricted decision making. They feel they are commanded all the time. Naturally, there’s disharmony. The lawmakers who had more power, used as an excuse, the effort they needed for the process of education, to demand as earned the leisure to think deeply, but the danger was that they often made rules that only benefited their consumption, and failed to contribute equitably to the empires, city states, or small communities they purported to guide. This is not an easy thing, to take subjective human cravings and make them objective for the populace to agree on their deservedness. It’s easy for friends and family to make pacts to allow unlimited consumption for each other and to defend each other on the basis of friendship and familial love, and of course love based on psychoanalytical observations comes from people helping each other improve their pleasure and consumption. We tend to love people who make things pleasant for us. They satisfy our cravings.
Ego Psychology: Anna Freud Pt. 10: https://rumble.com/v6snovr-ego-psychology-anna-freud-pt.-10.html
What was considered “good,” and worth fighting for, was what was in demand, especially in trade, and was one of the contributions that common people were allowed to partake in. Trade provided an identity for different regions based on what resources could be located. Antiphanes provided some examples. “From Elis comes the cook; from Argos the cauldron, from Phlius wine, from Corinth bedspreads; fish from Sicyon, flute-girls from Aegion, cheese from Sicily…perfumes from Athens, eels from Boeotia.”
The Deipnosophistae of Athenaeus: https://penelope.uchicago.edu/thayer/e/roman/texts/athenaeus/
Hermippus recounted the blessings. “Tell me now, ye Muses that dwell in Olympian mansions, all the blessings which [Dionysus] hath brought hither to men in his black ship.”
From Kūrēnē, stalks of silphium and hides of oxen;
From the Hellespont mackerel and all kinds of salt-dried fish;
From Thessaly, puddings and ribs of beef…
From the Syracusans, pigs and cheese…
Those cities, those products. From Egypt, rigging…
For sails and papyrus; from Syria, frankincense;
From glorious Crete, cypress for the gods;
From Africa, ivory in plenty at a price;
From Rhodes, raisins and dried figs bringing sweet dreams;
From Euboia, pears and well-fleeced apples;
From Phrygiā, slaves…
From Pagasai, slaves with a brand-mark on them;
From the Paphlagonians, Zeus’ own acorns and glossy
Almonds, the adornments of a dinner;
From Phoenicia; the fruit of the palm and fine flour;
From Carthage, carpets and bright-coloured cushions.
There’s a constant need for rules and regulations to know how to behave around goods and services, and to know what is culturally agreed upon at any one time. Some of those laws could escalate in punishment depending on the perceived harm. During the time of Socrates, and before his arrival on the scene, Athens experienced repeated tumult. Each leader of Athens invented their own code of conduct for the populace which was always to fix what went on before. The first leader of Athens was Draco, which was the inspiration for the term Draconian, in that he wanted harsh penalties for what are considered smaller infractions today. “For death was the punishment for almost every offence, so that even men convicted of idleness were executed, and those who stole pot-herbs or fruits suffered just like sacrilegious robbers and murderers. So that Demades afterwards made the joke that Drakon’s laws were not written with ink, but with blood. It is said that Drakon himself, when asked why he had fixed the punishment of death for most offences, answered that he considered these lesser crimes to deserve it, and he had no greater punishment for more important ones.”
Star Trek TNG — Crime and Punishment: https://youtu.be/G7XqGiwfUyI?si=CFo3XMwQQAHViaku
Plutarch’s Lives: https://www.gutenberg.org/files/14033/14033-h/14033-h.htm#LIFE_OF_SOLON
Solon followed and made reforms so that the earlier laws had been reduced in punitiveness for some of the criminal sentences. He also expanded democracy by allowing property ownership to compete against aristocracy. He as well reduced some forms of slavery that were based on insolvency. This proto-democracy was then overthrown by Pisistratus. He was considered a moderate tyrant that grew increasingly corrupt over time. His son and successor was assassinated. Cleisthenes was later credited with putting Athenian rule more on the track of democracy. Around that time ostracism was introduced to allow a 6,000 citizen referendum to remove people who were suspected of ambitions for tyranny. Cleisthenes also expanded the number of tribes to decentralize power from the 4 traditional tribes up to 10. To further fight against nepotism and cronyism, Cleisthenes allowed sortition to randomly select citizens for government office.
Sparta at the time was already in rivalry with Athens and attempts to ally with the Persians against them were misconstrued as submission. Any revolts or revolutions were treated as a breach of oath by the Persians. Ephialtes expanded on Cleisthenes with a more radical democracy, introducing the popular assembly. Many of these changes had the same motivation, which was to fix failures of leadership and bad choices, especially failed military campaigns. Ephialtes was assassinated for those changes towards decentralization, most likely by oligarchs. During the Peloponnesian War, Athens was defeated. Sparta installed an oligarchy of Thirty Tyrants. This time they were tyrannical in the regular sense of the term for their executions and exiles. The desire to reassert oligarchy on people who were used to democracy led to rebellion by Thrasybulus, and so a new democracy arose that ruled the oligarchs with more mercy as a lesson learned, to avoid the same kind of killing spree that happened under the Thirty Tyrants. The back and forth between forms of oligarchy and democracy continued into the classical period of Pericles. Socrates, according to Plato, was at a time where many of the philosophical debates raged over what a good government was. A fear of a democratic mob or tyrannical oligarchy taking power motivated these important debates. So the motivation to protect consumption was compounded with a more primal motivation for survival.
In Ancient Greece, debates centered around contribution. Hereditary claims were originally started by great men who made great contributions in the form of military escapades, increased commerce and when they administered politics in a fair manner. Honor, glory, and virtue. Entitlements could extend too far where consumption would overtake contribution, leading to resentment and rivalry, thereupon renegotiations for citizenship would start again. Elites needed time and money, through an all common slave system, so they could study philosophy, rhetoric, and governance. Religion was used as a way to legitimize leaders with the stamp of virtue. Having manners and being well-spoken kept the elites in their roles and made them seem necessary for the complex intricacies of politics. An amateur couldn’t easily strut into power and be expected to know what to do. Symposia wine drinking parties solidified networks of the elite and kept other classes out of the loop of knowledge. When one was too busy with work and illiterate, it was hard to organize rebellions and to know what reforms were needed. If one didn’t like the situation, a lack of education would prevent clear arguments from arising, and a fear of reprisal from the gods would keep people in their place. Emotions of pride and glory could be enjoyed in moderation with leaders, but in excess were transformed into hubris and tyranny. When in power, it’s easy to believe that one is a god through imitation of those archetypes. Repeated subservience would confirm it, but demonstrations of virtue were needed in both actuality and appearance, and when it was only an appearance, there was an expectation of shame.
What was the same then as now were those human appetites that were addictive. Repeated stimulus led to boredom that would result in a need to consume at a more refined level. The desire for more requires more exploitation of the common populace. Cronyism and nepotism that protected those privileges festered as important families centralized power and ownership, to make lasting those ever higher levels of consumption. Developing and growing the Athens economy for increasing consumption required more trade with other societies who could compare and envy, and so there was a parallel need to invest in security to protect goods and property from invasion and pillage. Alliances were made and broken as different groups jockeyed for dominance.
In this environment, Socrates was an easy target for scapegoating, because any questioning of religion, government, commerce, and philosophy could spread and sow discord within the prevailing system. There would be a hypervigilance from the established families to foresee acts of rebellion or foreign intrusion.
The Life of Socrates
When it comes to the life of Socrates, who left no written record, there are many historical accounts that inferred about his early life, including the inference that he was familiar with literary works and important political events throughout his life. “There was, of course, an official record of his trial and condemnation, which fell in the spring of the year 399 B.C., and Plato has told us that at the time of the trial he was seventy, or rather older. Hence we shall be very nearly right if we assume him to have been born in the year 470, only nine years after the decisive repulse of the Persian army at Plataea. Thus, when Socrates was born, Pericles was still a very young man, Sophocles and Euripides were lads; Aeschylus had produced his great drama of patriotism, the Persians, some two years before, at the charges of Pericles. The philosopher might have been present as a boy at the performance of the Agamemnon, and have witnessed every one of the great tragedies of Sophocles and Euripides. All the noble buildings and works of art with which Athens was enriched in the Periclean age, the Long Walls which connected the city with the port of Piraeus, the Parthenon, the statues of Phidias, the frescoes of Polygnotus, were begun and completed under his eyes. The confederacy of Delos, the germ of the Athenian maritime empire, had been formed less than ten years before his birth; he must already have been old enough to be beginning to take notice of what was happening around him when the foundations of Periclean democracy were laid by the ostracism of Pericles’ rival Cimon, son of Miltiades (461 B.C.), and the institution of public pay for the democratic jury-courts. He was already a young man of twenty-four or twenty-five when Athens and Sparta concluded the ‘thirty years’ peace, which left Athens, at the price of abandoning her aspirations to dominion on land, free to consolidate her control over the Aegean and to become the first naval power in the world. He was already on the verge of forty at the outbreak of the long war which was to end in the destruction of Athenian greatness.”
It’s also shadowy when it comes to Socrates’ family and method of livelihood, or if he received an inheritance. He was demonstratively poor towards the end of his life and the only certain wealth he would have earned on his own came from his military service. “We do not know much about the parents of Socrates. Plato tells us in the Laches that Sophroniscus was connected by ties of close friendship with the family of his famous fellow-demesman the ‘just’ Aristides, and implies that he was a man of some consideration in the deme. In the Crito it is implied that he was conscientiously careful to give his son the recognized elementary education in ‘gymnastic’ and music. Phaenarete—the name seems to indicate that she was a woman of good family—had, by another husband, a son named Patrocles; Plato tells us in the Theaetetus that she had high skill as an accoucheuse. (The statement has sometimes been regarded as a pleasantry, but there seems to be no point in it if it is an invention, and we are not, of course, to commit the anachronism of supposing that Phaenarete was a professional midwife.) The Alexandrian tradition, still commonly repeated as fact, is that Sophroniscus was a craftsman, a statuary, or stone-cutter…Socrates himself had never followed any craft. He is depicted as always having had absolute leisure to occupy himself as his tastes directed, and as having consorted from the first with the most distinguished men of Athens, the circles of Pericles and Cimon…Whether Sophroniscus was a statuary or not, we must not make the mistake of thinking of Socrates as belonging to a needy class, like the modern ‘proletariat.’ He was extremely poor in his old age—after a disastrous war which resulted in a general ‘financial crisis’—but Plato makes a point of it that this poverty was directly due to absorption in a ‘mission’ which left no time for attendance to ‘personal affairs.’ Down to his forty-sixth year, at any rate, he cannot have belonged to the poorest class of Athenian citizens, as he was still serving in as a ‘hoplite’ or fully-armed infantryman, and must have been officially credited with the income which rendered him liable to this service.”
Most of the records agree that Socrates had a distinguished military record which supports the idea that he was the type to be under control in the heat of battle, so he was capable of heroism, as can be seen in the events at the end of his life. “The military service of Socrates, so far as we are informed about it, belongs—apart from the probable early participation in the blockade of Samos under Pericles—to the Archidamian War. Plato relates that he distinguished himself by exceptional bravery at the siege of Potidaea (431-430 B.C.), and again on the disastrous field of Delium (424 B.C.), where the whole military force of Athens was routed by the Boeotians. A third campaign, before Amphipolis, mentioned by Plato, is commonly supposed to refer to the action outside that city in 422 B.C., in which both the Athenian and the Spartan commanders, Cleon and Brasidas, lost their lives, though Professor Burnet has suggested that the reference may be rather to the fighting which accompanied the foundation of Amphipolis, some fifteen years earlier. It is clear from Plato’s accounts that Socrates’ record for military courage and presence of mind stood very high.”
The records are not in agreement as to Socrates’ intimate partnerships, and like many ancient sources, they include embellishments and gossip. “Little is recorded of the external events of the life of Socrates during the first ten years of the struggle, those of the ‘Archidamian War’ beyond a few facts relating to his excellent military record. But it must have been at this time of his life that he married the only wife he is known to have had, Xanthippe, since we know from Plato that at the time of his death he left one son who was a lad, i.e. not more than seventeen or eighteen, and two small children, the youngest of whom appears to have been an infant in arms. The names of Xanthippe and of her eldest and youngest sons suggest good birth. The Alexandrian biographers represented Xanthippe as a shrew with an ungovernable temper and a foul tongue, but no hint of the kind is found in either Plato or Xenophon. In the Phaedo, the only place where Plato mentions her, she appears simply as an affectionate wife with whom Socrates has a prolonged last interview immediately before his death, and Xenophon records nothing of her except that her eldest son thought her, as sons often think a good mother, over-bearing, and that Antisthenes apparently did not like her. Presumably, then, Socrates only contracted the marriage in midlife. The Alexandrians had a story that he had also another wife, Myrto, said to be a relative of the great Aristides. But their stories about Myrto are contradictory. They make her sometimes the daughter, sometimes the granddaughter, of Aristides, sometimes the first wife of Socrates, sometimes the second. Sometimes they even assert that Socrates was married to both wives at once—apparently an invention of the scandal-monger Aristoxenus—and even tell a foolish tale that he took a second wife to comply with an imaginary Athenian statute providing for the repair of the loss of population due to the war by the legalization of bigamy. (It would be chronologically possible that Socrates should have been twice married, but the silence of Plato and Xenophon makes it unlikely that he was.)”
In terms of his identity, Socrates easily stood out as unusual to Athenians in both looks and personality. “From his earliest days Socrates must have been something of what we call an ‘oddity,’ both physically and mentally. His physical robustness and powers of endurance are dwelt upon by both Plato and Xenophon, and partly explain the excellence of his record as a fighting-man. Stress is laid upon his exceptional continence and abstemiousness in eating and drinking, and also upon his power, on appropriate occasions, of drinking deep without being affected by the winecup. In his manhood he used to wear the same single garment winter and summer, and habitually went barefoot, even, according to Plato, in the rigours of a winter campaign. But he was very far from being handsome or well made. Aristophanes compared his walk to the strut of a waterfowl, and made fun of his habit of rolling his eyes; Plato and Xenophon both allude to the breadth of his nostrils and the marked snubness of his nose, as well as to some peculiarity of his eyes, which may be either their prominence or the breadth of the space between them. He looked, says Alcibiades in Plato’s Symposium, like some grotesque, a satyr or a Silenus…Mentally, also, Socrates was in more than one way singular. His most striking singularity was the mysterious ‘voice’ or ‘supernatural sign,’ which attended him from the days of his childhood. According to Plato, who treats the peculiarity very lightly, the ‘sign’ manifested itself sporadically, often on very trivial occasions, and always took the form of a sudden inhibition; experience showed that neglect of its warnings commonly led to unpleasant consequences. Its chief interest for us is that it is one indication among others that Socrates really possessed the temperament of the ‘visionary,’ though, unlike most seers of visions, he kept that side of his nature well in check, as St. Paul did his gift for ‘speaking with tongues.’ Another mark of the visionary temperament dwelt on by Plato is his liability to sudden fits of absorption and abstraction, amounting at times to actual trance or ‘ecstasy.’ These were apparently usually of brief duration, but Plato records one which befell the philosopher as he was serving before Potidaea, and lasted the whole of a day and a night.”
Socrates was aware of the Presocratics, was inspired by them, so the shift in philosophy from astronomy to concerns for humanity was partly his predilection. “Socrates began, we are told, as an enthusiast for research into Nature eager to discover the ’causes of the coming of things into being and their passing away. He studied the various current cosmological theories, Eastern and Western—it is indicated that he began with those of the two contemporary teachers of the Eastern type of theory at Athens, Archelaus and Diogenes of Apollonia—and was particularly struck by the disagreement about the shape of the earth. He knew the biological doctrines of the Sicilian Empedocles and the theories of the Italian Alcmaeon of Crotona about the brain as an organ of mental life, and had been much troubled by mathematical difficulties connected with the notion of the unit, a problem raised by Zeno. At first the flat contradictions between the tenets of rival theorists brought him to desperation, but a passage read to him from the book of Anaxagoras came as a revelation. Mind, said Anaxagoras, is the cause of all natural law and order, just as mind is the cause of the orderliness and coherence of human action. To Socrates this suggested that the universe at large is the embodiment, like a properly conducted human life, of coherent rational plan. If Mind is the cause of the world’s structure, the earth and everything else in the universe must have just the shape, position, place in the scheme, which it is best that each of them should have. He set himself to the study of Anaxagoras in the hope that he had found a teacher who would put an end to scientific uncertainty by showing how it is best that every detail of the universe should be disposed, and how it must therefore be disposed in a world controlled by Mind. These hopes were speedily dashed when it appeared that Anaxagoras merely introduced Mind into his scheme to provide the initial impetus to the vortex motion by which he supposed stellar systems to be generated, without making any use of the thought that a universe controlled by Mind must be the embodiment of intelligent plan. It was this early disappointment which led Socrates, as he humorously puts it, to conclude that he ‘had no head for the natural sciences’ and to strike out a line of investigation and a method of his own.”
The Presocratics: Anaxagoras: https://rumble.com/v4erh9k-the-presocratics-anaxagoras.html
The Presocratics: Zeno of Elea: https://rumble.com/v1ydoqc-the-presocratics-zeno-of-elea.html
The Presocratics: Empedocles: https://rumble.com/v4gwesw-the-presocratics-empedocles.html
The Presocratics: Diogenes of Apollonia: https://rumble.com/v4jqfph-the-presocratics-diogenes-of-apollonia.html
Euthyphro
One of the early Plato dialogues expands on Socrates’ questioning of common beliefs that originated from religion and traditional received wisdom. According to Plato and Socrates, what we receive from culture must be examined. Morality has dimensions of contradiction and hypocrisy that only appear if you question it. Socrates saw that when you dissect many beliefs, views, and attitudes, they often fail to be reasonable. He received an indictment of impiety in his last years, but instead of just accepting it, he wanted above all to understand it. By questioning Euthyphro, who was prosecuting his father at the time, also for a lack of piety, it was a perfect opportunity for Socrates to set things straight by comparing that suit with his indictment, and by proxy making Euthyphro a prosecutor of Socrates.
Soc: “His name, I think, is Meletus. He belongs to the deme of Pitthus, if you recall a Pitthean Meletus with lanky hair and not much beard, but a hooked nose…It is no small thing for him, young as he is, to be knowledgeable in so great a matter, for he says he knows how the youth are being corrupted and who is corrupting them. No doubt he is wise, and realizing that, in my ignorance, I corrupt his comrades, he comes to the City as to a mother to accuse me. He alone seems to me to have begun his political career correctly, for the right way to begin is to look after the young men of the City first so that they will be as good as possible, just as a good farmer naturally looks after his young plants first and the rest later. So too with Meletus. He will perhaps first weed out those of us who blight the young shoots, as he claims, and afterwards he will obviously look after their elders and become responsible for many great blessings to the City, the natural result of so fine a beginning…He says I am a maker of gods, and because I make new ones and do not worship the old ones, he indicted me on their account, he says.”
Euthyphro was friendly at first and esteemed himself and Socrates as being prognosticators, that are often right about many things, but those predictions at times disturbed others. Intuition in Socrates’ times appeared liked one was acting as if an oracle, but at the same time there was always a necessity for thinking ahead to avoid predictable consequences in daily life. The problem happens when awareness is placed on the powerful. “I see, Socrates. It is because you say the divine sign comes to you from time to time. So he indicts you for making innovations in religious matters and hales you into court to slander you, knowing full well how easily such things are misrepresented to the multitude. Why I, even me, when I speak about religious matters in the Assembly and foretell the future, why, they laugh at me as though I were mad. And yet nothing I ever predicted has failed to come true. Still, they are jealous of people like us. We must not worry about them, but face them boldly.”
Socrates deep down felt that cleverness was often ignored, but when it threatened to turn from ideas into movements, something had to be done. “The Athenians, it seems to me, do not much mind if they think a man is clever as long as they do not suspect him of teaching his cleverness to others; but if they think he makes others like himself they become angry, whether out of jealousy as you suggest, or for some other reason…Perhaps they think you give yourself sparingly, that you are unwilling to teach your wisdom. But I fear my own generosity is such that they think I am willing to pour myself out in speech to any man—not only without pay, but glad to pay myself if only someone will listen.”
Euthyphro’s situation was one of those legal knots that cannot be resolved privately, like in his case, of feeling impelled to prosecute one’s father for fear of not being pious to the gods, which was a greater fear for him than going against his family. Claims of unfairness are often competing against familial relations, social convention, and concerns about the contributions and pedigree of the accused. “…The dead man was a day-laborer of mine, and when we were farming in Naxos he worked for us for hire. Well, he got drunk and flew into a rage with one of our slaves and cut his throat. So my father bound him hand and foot, threw him in a ditch, and sent a man here to Athens to consult the religious adviser as to what should be done. In the meantime, my father paid no attention to the man he had bound; he neglected him because he was a murderer and it made no difference if he died. Which is just what he did. Before the messenger got back he died of hunger and cold and his bonds. But even so, my father and the rest of my relatives are angry at me for prosecuting my father for murder in behalf of a murderer. He did not kill him, they claim, and even if he did, still, the fellow was a murderer, and it is wrong to be concerned on behalf of a man like that—and anyway, it is unholy for a son to prosecute his father for murder. They little know, Socrates, how things stand in religious matters regarding the holy and the unholy.”
Socrates became intrigued and requested a definition of piety so that clarity could prevail as to whether one’s actions were actually pious or accidentally impious in any situation. Euthyphro criticized those who held him in contempt because they followed different laws depending on whether people were relations or not, but hypocritically they concurred with religious excuses that Zeus was right to “put his own father in bonds for unjustly swallowing his children; yes, and that father had in his turn castrated his father for similar reasons. Yet me they are angry at for indicting my father for his injustice. So they contradict themselves: they say one thing about the gods and another about me.”
On Socrates’ side, he wondered if he was legitimately guilty of being impious for finding religious stories to be “difficult to accept…Do you believe there is really war among the gods, and terrible enmities and battles, and other sorts of things our poets tell, which embellish other things sacred to us…Are we, Euthyphro, to say those things are so?” The common way of defining a subject leads most people to provide examples, but Socrates was more interested in essences. Euthyphro responded by searching for more examples and the pattern he noticed was that “what is dear to the gods is holy, and what is not dear to them is unholy.” Socrates clarified that it’s both people and objects that are loved and hated in this definition they were to discuss.
The problem for Socrates is that different gods love and hate different people and things which leads to confusion. “Now, Euthyphro, we also said, did we not, that the gods quarrel and disagree with one another and that there is enmity among them?” Even further these gods seemed to have very human attitudes involving bickering and enmity, but even humans, according to Socrates, could work together to find an agreement in many situations before escalating to conflict. “If you and I disagreed about a question of number, about which of two sums is greater, would our disagreement cause us to become angry with each other and make us enemies? Or would we take to counting in a case like that, and quickly settle our dispute? So too, if we disagreed about a question of the larger or smaller, we would take to measurement and put an end to our disagreement quickly?” Socrates saw the problem that qualities of personality, like their level of authenticity in piety, couldn’t easily be measured like a quantity. Despite being gods, they were repeatedly bested by confusion and conflict, whereas a rational human at times could transcend that. “Then the same things, it seems, are both hated by the gods and loved by the gods, and would be both dear to the gods and hateful to the gods…So, Euthyphro, it would not be surprising if what you are now doing in punishing your father were dear to Zeus, but hateful to Cronos and Uranus, and loved by Hephaestus, but hateful to Hera, and if any of the other gods disagree about it, the same will be true of them too.”
Because many different examples are loved and hated by their own characteristics and situations, Socrates wanted to improve the definition of piety realizing that some situations will be loved or hated by ALL the gods. There’s a knowing in Socrates that this type of thinking is laborious and most people will just take what’s culturally given. Putting extra thought is an effort that people try to avoid. In this case, Socrates felt that accepting received wisdom without examination, or resorting to cause and effect, is not good enough to reach the essence. “Well, Euthyphro, should we examine this in turn to see if it is true? Or should we let it go, accept it from ourselves or anyone else without more ado, and agree that a thing is so if only some one says it is? Or should we examine what a person means when he says something? Is the holy loved by the gods because it is holy? Or is it holy because it is loved by the gods?…We speak of carrying and being carried, of leading and being led, of seeing and being seen. And you understand in such cases, do you not, that they differ from each other, and how they differ? [It is not] because it is affected that the affecting exists, but because of the affecting, the thing is affected. Do you agree? And so it is as true here as it was before: It is not because a thing is being loved that there is loving by those who love it; it is because of the loving that it is being loved…Then what is dear to the gods is not [the same as] holy, Euthyphro, nor is the holy [the same as] dear to the gods, as you claim: the two are different.”
By association Socrates wanted to use other definitions, like in a dictionary and thesaurus, where you look up all the words you don’t know and use those definitions filled with the words you are still confident you understand. “I really want arguments to stand still, to stand fixed and immovable. I want that more than the wealth of Tantalus and the skill of Daedalus combined. But enough of this. Since you seem to be lazy and soft, I will come to your aid and help you teach me about the holy. Don’t give up; consider whether you do not think that all the holy is necessarily just…Is all the just holy? Or is all the holy just, but not all the just holy—part of it holy, part something else?” The finding of essences is about finding mixed characteristics and removing those mixed elements to get at the pure ore of definition. “Teach me what part of the just is holy, so that I may tell Meletus to wrong me no longer and not to indict me for impiety, since I have already learned from you what things are pious and holy and what are not.”
Euthyphro and Socrates then agreed that justice involves the good, which has to do with service and productivity, and so in this definition it means to do good for both gods and people. It’s easy to see how people contributed and provided service for each other in exchange, but with the gods it was not so certain what deities actually needed. “So what do you say the holy and holiness is this time? Knowledge of how to pray and sacrifice?…To sacrifice is to give to the gods and to pray is to ask something from them? Then by this account, holiness is knowledge of how to ask from and give to the gods…To give rightly is to give in return what they happen to need from us? For surely there would be no skill involved in giving things to someone that he did not need…So the art of holiness would be a kind of business transaction between gods and men…What benefit do the gods gain from the gifts they receive from us? It is clear to everyone what they give, for we have nothing good they have not given [already]. But how are they benefited by what they get from us? Or do we claim the larger share in the transaction to such an extent that we get all good from them, and they nothing from us?”
Euthyphro believed the gods needed praise and basked in honor which backtracked to his initial steps. “Then, on the contrary, the holy is what is loved by the gods.” They were back to square one because logically these Greek gods who needed human rewards like praise and honor also required definitions of what was praiseworthy and what was honorable. There’s always a need in these discussions to do away with human projections of gods and replace them with a rule that is self-evident and embedded in human action, which naturally would lead to accusations of impiety against Socrates. The abstraction explained the behavior of the gods, but a good definition must include the good and the just without being tainted by confusing opposites. Virtues may be intermixed with each other, but they are all under the same category called GOOD. Unfortunately for Socrates Euthyphro ran out of time and had to end the conversation before he could find a definition pure enough to use in his own defense, and likely Euthyphro would not want to be named as a source of wisdom that the city wanted to condemn.
For Socrates, these discussions were of paramount importance because governments created standards and rules that should be based on sound logic and truth, that make it easy for people to follow what is good and not accidentally find themselves in trouble. It required a universal standard, and it had to exclude the gods, because humans cannot consult them so handily when events are moving fast. They have to make their human judgements on their own, on top of the fact that praying to a god or providing a sacrifice cannot scientifically guarantee an appearance of a god that everyone can see and verify. Humans are on their own to make their own judgments, and there’s a certain freedom in being able to use one’s intellectual faculties, as long as enough effort is put in to consider the interests of others along with one’s own. From the secular point of view, gods are just human projections and imaginations based on a powerful elite who exhibit these same capricious and querulous behaviors, and ALL the punishments for spiritual transgressions in the end come from human establishment figures.
Establishment figures are creating rules that benefit their class, and what is deemed pious or impious is their attempt to find an even higher figure to defend them when they are in a dispute. God to Socrates would not need to be a human image, but clear principles and definitions touching on what is virtuous or maybe divine. Because regular people are stuck on examples when they have to defend their arguments, they don’t go to the level of Socrates who demanded clear definitions. True knowledge becomes a threat to the powerful because they may not be able to justify their actions towards slaves, as in Euthyphro’s example, or to go even further and question the notion of slavery. Laws may have to be revised and consequently those lawmakers would likely be removed from power if they resisted those changes. This kind of questioning can rearrange social structures based on updated understandings of virtue and merit, and upend structures that are a primitive alloy mixed with human inequity. “Socrates had requested, not an account of things which are holy, but an account of a Form of holiness, which might serve as a standard for judging what things are holy and what are not…The eidos or idea of holiness is a universal, the same in all its instances, and something all its instances have; it appears to be a condition for the existence of holy things, that by which (the dative is instrumental) holy things are holy; and it is a standard or paradigm for determining what things are holy and what are not. In short, the words eidos and idea here carry freight they do not ordinarily bear; for that reason, commentators have often translated them as ‘Idea’ or ‘Form.’ ‘Form,’ while it has Aristotelian overtones, escapes the subjective and psychological connotations that hover around the word ‘idea’ in English…Socrates wishes to know what is the same in every holy action—what is the nature of the Form all holy actions share.”
If there is a satisfactory definition of piety, it must be capable of adjusting to the evolving complexities of the world, accepting limitations while striving to maintain harmony. As societies advance and new technologies emerge, potential disharmonies must be assessed through the lens of fairness, justice, and the avoidance of exploitation. This is why someone like Euthyphro ultimately left the conversation unresolved—because harmony is not a fixed state but a continual negotiation. Societies tend to persist in their ways until harm is perceived; once a disharmony is exposed, reforms become necessary to minimize injustice. Innovations in exchange, products, services, and in new human structures will always carry some risk, and the challenge lies in assessing and correcting imbalances, anomalies, and absurdities as they arise.
The Dialogues of Plato, Volume 1: Euthyphro, Apology, Crito, Meno, Gorgias, Menexenus (v. 1) – R. E. Allen: https://www.isbns.net/isbn/9780300044881/
Socrates – Taylor, A. E: https://www.isbns.net/isbn/9781022896598/
Plato’s Ethics – Terence H. Irwin: https://www.isbns.net/isbn/9780195086454/
Plato’s Euthyphro, Apology, and Crito: Critical Essays – Rachana Kamtekar: https://www.isbns.net/isbn/9780742533240/
Plato’s Theory of Knowledge – Norman Gulley: https://www.isbns.net/isbn/9780313252099/
The Philosophy of Socrates – Norman Gulley: https://www.isbns.net/isbn/9780333095447/
Socrates – Gregory Socrates Vlastos: https://www.isbns.net/isbn/9780521314503/
The Religion of Socrates – Mark L. Mcpherran: https://www.isbns.net/isbn/9780271015811/
Philosophy: https://psychreviews.org/category/philosophy03/